You are currently logged-out. You can log-in or create an account to see more talks, save favorites, and more.

Being Here: Embracing Zen Thusness

(AI Title)
00:00
00:00
Audio loading...
Serial: 
RB-03806

AI Suggested Keywords:

Summary: 

Practice-Period_Talks

AI Summary: 

The talk explores the concept of "here" during a Zen practice period, challenging conventional notions of presence and absence. Emphasizing "Here" as the sole focus instead of a comparison with "there," the discourse delves into complex ideas surrounding Thusness, emptiness, and interdependence articulated through the Hokyo Zammai, composed by Dongshan. It examines how changing worldviews can facilitate enlightenment, proposing that understanding arises through experiencing patterns of emptiness and interdependence rather than perceiving fixed entities.

Referenced Works and Concepts:

  • Hokyo Zammai (Jewel Samadhi Mirror Transmission) by Dongshan:
    The text serves as a foundation for understanding the interplay between form and emptiness, with imagery like "a silver bowl filled with snow," illustrating the inseparability yet distinctness of these concepts.

  • Dogen's Teaching:
    Referring to Dogen's observation of a bridge flowing rather than the river, as a metaphor for reversing perceptions to achieve a worldview shift crucial for practice and enlightenment.

  • The Dharma of Thusness:
    Discussed as a transmission from Buddhas and ancestors, this concept focuses on the realization born out of emptiness, forming the experiential basis of one's life and practice.

  • Interdependence and Buddhist Cosmology:
    Contrasts secular cosmological theories like the Big Bang with the Buddhist view of co-interdependence, suggesting that relationships define existence rather than discrete beginnings or entities.

AI Suggested Title: Being Here: Embracing Zen Thusness

Is This AI Summary Helpful?
Your vote will be used to help train our summarizer!
Transcript: 

Gisela, how nice that you're here. I guess Gisela and Gerald and I were the first practitioners and residents here, founding members. Isn't that true? And we did that together at Crestone, too. And we're thinking about, no, I'm not. This is enough. Yeah. But I never dreamed, Gisela, that we'd do a practice period here. And now, somehow all these people talk me into it. And it was great, Gerald, you could join us for three weeks. Thanks. You know, the here of practice period is not based on that there's also a there.

[01:28]

This is a here that's only a here and there's no there out there. At least that's how we can think about it. And how we think about things has, of course, profound effect on how we feel and so forth. So if your sense of being here is based on that you're not there with your spouse or your children or your Yeah, then you're not really here. When you're really here, all the there's disappear. And sometimes practitioners feel rather guilty.

[02:49]

I don't miss my spouse at all or my children. This is terrible. And of course, that would be only partly true, but it's surprising how much the sense of this here can feel like an uninterrupted time and an uninterrupted space and there is nothing else. Now various things have come up that just surprisingly, you know, Just in the context of doing this practice period for a little while now, various themes have come up that we ought to talk about.

[03:56]

And one that's sort of like pressing on me a bit is how our innermost request is brought into the dharmic, durative presence. And the topic that is pressing me the most is the question of how our deepest concern can be incorporated into our dharmic present, which is the duration. But that's only a sort of promise for a future teisho. I just can't do everything at once. And one of the themes that sort of got started is looking at, explicating the hokkyo-zanmae.

[05:00]

I'm trying to translate explicating. Oh, really? I can't help you. It's okay. Explicate is to fold. Explicate is to unfold. Okay. Pleats, like pleats are folds. This is an unpleating of something. Explicate. Okay. I did help you. You did, yes. Yeah. And this road... As we know, it doesn't go anywhere.

[06:16]

It's only a road we cross. And if a chicken does cross it, it doesn't know it's crossing a road. It has no concept of roads. The road is only passing under it. Die Straße unterquert nur das Huhn. That can be our feeling. Das kann unser Gefühl sein. And as you know, Dogen, Dongshan, said one of his enlightenment experiences when he left his teacher. Yeah, okay. He started on a trip and crossing a river on a bridge. He said, oh, it's the bridge that flows, not the river. This road which goes nowhere, it just passes under us.

[07:38]

See, I'm trying to use everyday things to say you can reverse the feeling of things and enter another kind of mind and worldview. I just say the various things to express that you can turn the feeling of things and thus enter a different spirit, a different worldview. And so Dongshan wrote, composed the Hokyo Zammai, the Jewel Samadhi Mirror Transmission. So I think it somehow occurred to me I should comment on it. If we're ever going to comment on it, what better time than during the practice period? So let me read you the first few lines.

[08:56]

And I think it feels more real to read it rather than just to say it. The Dharma of Thusness Transmitted by Buddhas and Buddha ancestors. Okay, what is dustness? Just to be simple, it's the experience of emptiness. Okay. And the Dharma, the realization of the appearance of thusness as fundamental to your life.

[10:00]

So this is his very first mind. That he hopes, was actually really hoping to transmit to us here in the Anasof Kuala Lama way. Certainly if he'd known about us he would be happy. There's actually no doubt about that. So he starts out with the Dharma of Thusness which we can only understand as when emptiness is the way of knowing the world that our life is based on. Can you say it again, please? That the experience of emptiness...

[11:03]

As a teaching. On which you base your lived activity. It's impossible for me to say things the same way twice. Sorry. it's not only Dung Shan telling us this, he says it's transmitted by Buddhas and Dharma ancestors. And that's why we are here, because it has been transmitted. Und deshalb sind wir hier, weil es übertragen wurde. We are part of the transmission. Wir sind Teil dieser Übertragung. It's not that, you know, those guys were really kind of religious geniuses, real smart and tough, and they sat in the snow all the time and never breathed.

[12:29]

Nicht einfach nur so, dass die Typen damals einfach irre klug und religiöse genies waren, die die ganze Zeit im Schnee gesessen haben und nie atmen mussten. No, they're just people like, persons like us. Nein, das waren Menschen wie wir. And some of them who were enlightened weren't as smart as you are. Und einige von denen, die Erleuchtung erlangt haben, waren nicht so klug wie ihr. This is your practice, our practice. Das ist deine Praxis, unsere Praxis. And so then the next line is, now you have it. Die nächste Zeile lautet, nun hast du es. then we can understand now you are able to have it. Or in the practice period we have it whether we know it or not. And he says preserve it well. Preserving it in this case means to actualize it. To actualize it, continue it.

[13:39]

And understand it well enough to know what you're actualizing. So the third line is a silver bowl filled with snow. Die dritte Zeile ist eine silberne Schale mit Schnee gefüllt. Yeah, when I first encountered this image, as I said the other day, in, yeah, probably 1961 or something. Before some of you were born. The feel of it never left me. And also, but not quite so vividly, the second image, a heron hidden in the moonlight. Und auch dieses zweite Bild, obwohl das nicht ganz so lebendig ist für mich, ein Reiher im Mondlicht versteckt.

[15:01]

Die vierte Zeile lautet, als ähnlich betrachtet, sind sie doch nicht gleich. even though they're not distinguished, their places are known. What the heck is he talking about? And I think that we ought to have some sense of what he's talking about. I think you're serious about our practice. I think you are serious about our practice, your practice. And here is the person considered the founder of our particular lineage.

[16:04]

And this is the first four lines of his teaching poem. Then he says the meaning does not reside in the words. But a pivotal moment brings it forth. Now a pivotal moment can mean something that an entscheidender Moment, das kann bedeuten, ein Moment, der dich erleuchtet, turns you toward or into an insight, der dich in Richtung oder in eine Einsicht hineindreht, die dich nie verlässt, turns you within an insight that

[17:17]

stays with you. Yes, that's interesting because lots of different insights can be enlightenment experiences. The difference is with an enlightenment experience you actually get on the other side of the insight, the new side of the insight. And you stay there. Out of sight. I mean... Okay. Now... If thusness is a word for emptiness, experienceable and experienced emptiness, and it's simultaneously a dharma, a teaching, an appearance, a dharma is also an appearance,

[18:44]

then what is a silver bowl filled with snow I mean we can say the silver bowl is thusness or emptiness And snow is form. And of course he's talking form is emptiness, emptiness is form. Now why doesn't he just say it's the emptiness of the silver bowl filled with the form of snow. Because when you're that explicit it's not quite true. Because if you can grasp it mentally you don't really get it as an experience.

[19:51]

Weil wenn du das mental begreifen kannst, dann verstehst du es nicht wirklich als Erfahrung. So I can say the chicken passes over the road. Ich könnte sagen, das Huhn überquert die Straße. And liken it to Dogen crossing a bridge that flows. Dungschan. Dungschan. Yeah, and try to suggest that this is everywhere present, it's not just a mental concept. So he says they're taken as similar. Form and emptiness are taken as similar. I mean, most of us just see form. We don't see emptiness. We're taken as similar. And as the same.

[21:14]

But then he says, but they are not the same. They're not the same. You should know they're not the same. And then he says, but they're also not distinguished. You can't tell the difference. But still you should know their places. And this pivotal moment that brings it forth doesn't have to be an insight or enlightenment. Every moment can be the pivotal moment. So we can understand the conceptual basis of practice period is to make every moment such a pivotal moment.

[22:41]

Okay. Now I'm just going to say some things. And maybe they don't don't have immediate relevance. But I hope in our living this life here they become relevant. I've said a couple times to the Sokut Now you all know who the soku is, right? You know? The soku is the person who oversees the meal service. Yeah. I've said to the soku a couple of times, if you bring in the offering tray along that path, you should leave with the offering tray along that path.

[24:03]

Or I've said to servers sometimes, You don't have to go all the way around there. If it's more convenient from the point of view of serving to just cut across here, please do that. Now, on what basis am I making these decisions? It looks arbitrary. In fact, it is arbitrary. I mean, somewhat arbitrary. Well, of course, the word arbitrary in English means to decide by yourself. It's not cosmically ordained.

[25:06]

You can decide by ourselves. There was the Big Bang And Fred Hoyle coined the word and it's been thought about and accepted since the 1950s. And scientific evidence corroborates the concept of the Big Bang. No, corroborates means it confirms the truth of it.

[26:10]

However, it's still probably a theological assumption. An assumption based on that what actually exists are things, substances. And substances have to have a beginning. And if you think of the world as made up of particles, and the word atom actually means can't be divided, then the particles, the things, I mean, they came from somewhere, they have to have a beginning. Now, a Buddhist world probably wouldn't have come up with the idea of the Big Bang. They might have come up with the idea of dark energy.

[27:27]

So one of the current ideas is probably anyone who reads newspapers knows if this world we're looking at and living in is 75% dark energy. Which means they don't know what the hell it is. It's not measurable. But you can guess that it's there because of various factors. And 23% is dark matter. And what we call the elements and the stuff of the world is only 2%. So everything we know of the world is only 2% of what science says seems to be out there or in here.

[28:30]

Now, why do I say, I'm just playing around, you know, here, right? And I don't know what I'm talking about. But I'm trying to suggest that I'm trying to suggest how pervasive worldviews are. And practice and enlightenment are based on a shift in worldviews. So, if we assume that The world is not entities made up of entities. It's only made up of arrangements.

[29:56]

I mean, suchness or emptiness just means everything's interdependent and the interdependence itself can't be grasped. As I say, a very basic is to see everything's an activity and not an entity. you have to drum that into your body and mind until you really see everything as an activity if you can do this your practice will really take have an actuality that it wouldn't otherwise Wenn du das tun kannst, dann wird deine Praxis eine Wirklichkeit erlangen, die sie sonst nicht bekommt. Okay.

[31:01]

Now, why do I say, in a Buddhist world we might say dark energy instead of the Big Bang? Warum sage ich, dass wir in einer buddhistischen Welt von dunkler Energie sprechen würden, statt von einem Urknall? Because if you believe everything is just relationships, weil wenn du davon ausgehst, dass alles nur Beziehungen sind, relationships exist because there's relationships, there doesn't have to be a beginning. Beziehungen existieren, weil es einfach Beziehungen gibt und die brauchen keinen Anbeginn. So, the most fundamental questions we can ask is, for example, it's practically the only example, was there a beginning to all this? Or was there no beginning? It's just always been something like this. And the Buddhist view clearly is it's many world systems changing into other world systems.

[32:20]

None of them are a beginning. They're just part of a process. So a Buddhist physicist might ask, maybe all the patterns, all the inner relationships themselves hold the world together or are a power or a presence. In other words, it's not the things that are holding it together, it's all the relationships The empty relationship that you can't grasp that hold things together. In other words, it's not the things that hold the world together, but it's all the relationships, the empty relationships that you can't understand that hold everything together.

[33:32]

Now, this latter idea is basically the Buddhist idea. Of co-interdependence or interdependence. Der Co-Interdependenz oder der wechselseitigen Abhängigkeit. So, what does a Buddhist see? A Buddhist see? See, understand, notice. Oh, okay. Also, was sieht ein Buddhist? I'm going to try to stop before you give up. Ich versuche aufzuhören, bevor ihr aufgeht. I know that brains stop working when knees start hurting. Yeah, okay. So, what does a Buddhist see? Well, I'm a Buddhist, I see this building. And I see this building a building. In the process of being built.

[34:36]

This building is just an arrangement. It's a pattern. Yeah, it's beams and boards. Yeah, glass and tiles. Gläser und Fliesen, danke. Verlegte Rohre und Kabel. And it's the ideas of the original builders and users and so forth. It's not for me a building, it's simply an arrangement. And we have a chance to see that because we're in the midst of rearranging it. Look at these lights, they're on me. They're not lighting, but they're there.

[35:41]

Okay, so what do I see? I see an arrangement. And what do I see us doing? We are an arrangement. Just as real as the building is an arrangement. Okay, so I'm trying to figure out how we should move in this building. Which is also ordering the durative present. Yeah, so... Some of what I've suggested is our movements are based on the architecture of the building. But the architecture of the building is also our use of the building.

[36:47]

How we walk around this room is also creating the building. And creating the Zendo. And there's, you know, in the middle of our meals, there's a skull. That's the Buddha bowl is Buddha's skull. Now, if you had a guest over for dinner and you told him, one of the bowls is Buddha's skull. Wenn du jetzt einen Gast zum Abendessen hättest und du würdest ihm sagen, dass eine der Schalen der Schädel des Buddhas ist... The guest might say, I'm sorry, can you put my rice in a different bowl? But we design this practice so there's a darn skull in the middle of our eating process.

[38:04]

And we try to make that distinction present by we bow before we enter the Buddha bowl, and we bow and we leave it, but we don't bow when we enter the middle bowl, the soup bowl, or whatever it is. Und wir versuchen diese Unterscheidung zum Ausdruck zu bringen, indem wir uns verneigen, wenn wir die Buddha-Schale anheben oder auch wenn wir sie wieder absetzen. Aber wir verneigen uns nicht, wenn wir die mittlere Schale oder die andere Schale aufnehmen. This is the Dharma of suchness. Das ist das Dharma der Soheit. So the bowls are just a pattern. Die Schalen sind einfach ein Muster. And, you know, if you have to pee in the middle of an Oryoki meal, you realize you're stuck in a pattern. And you can't get out of there. How do you get up and get the bowl? Excuse me, I have to go pee. And you can't get your own food. You have to wait until somebody brings it to you. And then they have to ring bells and they, you know, take their time and, you know... And you can't get your seconds until everybody gets their seconds.

[39:13]

So you're stuck in a pattern. It's very intentional. Because it's all empty. It's all just a pattern. And the pattern, the relationships are the only thing that's real in any consequential sense. This stick has no consequence as a stick. It only has a consequence as I use it.

[40:16]

As I've mentioned before, here where my hand is, or a hand can be, is the lotus embryo. And here's the seed pod. And here's a bud of the lotus. And where is the flower? The flower is you. The flower is my using it. It flowers when I use it. It's a very typical use of iconography in Buddhism. It's built into the design of the stick that its reality is its use. Now that's only the first 10% or 20% of what I'd like to say on this particular topic.

[41:31]

But I think it's time to say goodbye. Auf Wiedersehen, sweetheart, this lovely day. I wish I could sing. Has flown away.

[42:00]

@Transcribed_UNK
@Text_v005
@Score_76.24