What do you hear when you listen to that? Do you hear him breathing or something? No. When no one says anything, I don't hear anything. Then why are you listening? I wait for you to say something. Oh, okay. So now I know I should say something. Saying something. Okay. Okay. Someone have anything you want to say? But first, let me ask, how many of you were here for some of the winter branches last year? Who wasn't here at the winter branches last year? You didn't put your hand up for either. She wasn't here. Oh. I thought you weren't here because you didn't put your hand up in either case.

[01:03]

Okay. So, please, does somebody have something to say? I have a question. Yes. I'm wondering whether the mind that we are not born with but that we are generating, is that... A different one from the one that we are assuming to be present in others, even though they are not acting from it? Yes. How is it present with others? Deutsch, bitte. Der Geist, mit dem wir nicht geboren werden, den wir aber hervorbringen, und da frage ich mich, ob das der gleiche ist wie der Geist, Okay. If you try to state it too precisely in language, then it's... then it, yeah... then it sounds like perhaps it doesn't overlap.

[02:31]

But this mind is defined as the mind of knows how we actually exist. Okay. So if it's the mind that knows how we actually exist, even when we don't know how we actually exist, then still we actually exist in that way. And so in other people it's not articulated or realized but it's still present in various ways. And you can make it present in various ways. I'll try to give you an example of that before we go to lunch.

[03:36]

Now, please recognize that how we actually exist is a black box. You know what I mean by a black box? In science, it's where you can put everything, you can't define it. Yeah, but Buddhism rests on this, so we're stuck with this black box that Pandora may open. No, that Pandora can't open. This is the box Pandora can't open.

[04:49]

Pandora means the one who is giving everything. It's Greek language. And she was an old goddess who gave everything as a present, as a gift. And so maybe she is the one she really can. Yes, in that sense... Well, in German, please. I just said that Pandora means in Greek the one who gives everything. And in that sense Pandora is the one who really gives everything. She is an ancient goddess who first became part of Greece, who has the diseases in her box. But isn't it in mythology she's the one who also gave us all the troubles and diseases? The Greeks said that it was later. Oh, that's later, okay. So we'll go back to the early Pandora. Okay, someone else? I have a question that relates to that. I was of the opinion that we are born with it as babies, but that we have to learn to keep our physicality to the extent that we lose it.

[06:16]

And my question is whether he would agree with that. I used to think that the Zazen mind, when we were babies, we still had that Zazen mind. throughout our lives, and we had to learn to survive, we lost this kind of mind. And my question is whether you would agree with that. Because also babies sometimes seem to exist to us in a way that could be described as a black box. Well, let's leave the black box out. The question is, you're saying, do babies have

[07:18]

a mind of enlightenment naturally. That's definitely not my experience and definitely not Buddhism. But it's a kind of intuitive and natural idea. But first of all, babies are not neurologically developed when they're born. It takes some year or two. They take in what's happening in the present moment without associating anything. Well, in that sense, it's somewhat like Zazen mind. Isn't it also that there is nothing yet that they can associate?

[08:22]

Well, that helps them not make too many comparisons. German, please. quite a lot could be said about what you just said let me just say simply Zazen mind is an adult mind To such an extent that it's probably not so wise for teenagers to do zazen.

[09:42]

Because they probably ought to develop the mind of their culture pretty fully before they do zazen. Yeah, and I've also seen what look like examples of that to me with people who were part of the Maharishi Yogi. What was that? You've got a mantra, what's that called? TM. TM, Transcendental Meditation, whose parents were Transcendental Meditation teachers, so the kids did meditation, and almost all of them have rejected meditation, that I know, and have, I would say, somewhat damaged by doing it. And I even have some examples, I would say these are examples seen in the Maharashtrian movement, in the transcendental meditation, where the parents have all practiced the transcendental meditation and their children have also practiced it.

[10:51]

And almost all of them have later rejected meditation and did not like it anymore. And I would even go so far as to say they have been damaged a bit. So while Zazen mind ideally reflects how we actually exist, it reflects how we actually exist in the midst of all the problems and habits and desires we have as a usual state of mind. And in fact, many of the teachings through which we realize Buddha mind are indexed to our problematic mind. Many of the teachings through which we enter Buddha's activity or Buddha's mind are indexed to our habits of seeing things as permanent, for example.

[12:07]

The idea of indexing is a very important idea in the Abhidharma teaching. Okay, so I hope the more basically we can look at this stuff, the more deeply we'll be able to practice it. Someone else? I've bought this book by a professor, Paul Williams' name. And the title is My Path to Buddhism and Back. In and out, yeah. And as a professor, he dealt with Buddhism intensely for about 20 years. And he translated texts by the Dalai Lama.

[13:45]

And he translated texts by the Dalai Lama. And this book depicts his path back towards Catholicism and towards a very almost fundamental or fundamentalist, what do you mean? Fundamental Catholicism. I tried to read this book and I couldn't get out of it through various attempts where I read a few pages. I've tried to read this book, but I couldn't get more than a couple of pages. I couldn't read more than a couple of pages. I can imagine why. Because it took away lots of my energy.

[14:57]

And that was because he tried to prove in this book, which is not possible in the first place, to prove that Buddhism is simply wrong, while Catholicism is true. And I asked myself, how can it be that someone who has been dealing with Buddhism for 20 years And then he goes this way. And it became clear to me that he simply did not practice. And he also writes that in the book, that his kind of meditation was busy with the Buddhist texts. And I was wondering how is it possible for someone who's involved with Buddhism for 20 years and so intensely for him to come to this conclusion. And then I came to the conclusion that he was simply not practicing and he writes that too, that he wasn't practicing. Yeah, it sounds like you're

[15:58]

analysis is right. But even if you were a practitioner, if you have some sort of conversion experience of belief in Christianity, then that's what you believe. But even if you practice and have a kind of conversion experience in the Catholic sense, and then you have your faith, then that's just what you will continue to believe. You know, and I listen sometimes when I'm driving somewhere in America to these Protestant radio preachers. And I sometimes hear, when I drive a car in America, the Protestant radio preachers on the radio. So they speak, and sometimes I just wish it were that easy. But if you watch them on television,

[17:05]

And these ones who create, you know, do healing and they touch people and they fall into faints and stuff like that. Yeah, if you study their movements and the way they get people involved, it's very yogic what they do. They basically create a yogic space and then make use of it. They know what they're doing intuitively, but they don't have any Abhidharma background to how they're doing it. You know, I watched, I saw on television, a film or a television or something, of a concert of Michael Jackson.

[18:18]

I haven't mentioned this for years, but Michael Jackson in some place like, after the wall came down, some place like Budapest, I don't know. Half of Eastern Europe was in the audience. Or all of youthful Eastern Europe was in the audience. I mean, it was thousands, tens of thousands, I don't know, huge number of people. It was a huge first concert after the Wall came down. And he concentrated all these people in his body And he stood there, actually stuck still. And then he raised one finger. And the whole audience burst into a huge noise.

[19:31]

That's yogic skill. But it's a skill that destroyed him. Yes. So this is actually not my question, but just something to add. Someone else is pushing through you. I was about 12 years or 13 years a schoolboy, and in West Berlin we have a big event with Billy Graham. All school boys have to work there. It was a huge event. I felt an incredible physical aversion at that time.

[20:42]

That was 12, 13 years after the war. I felt an immense physical aversion and that was 12 or 13 years after the war. Yeah, because... Was this hysteria of the masses? Yeah. Well, this use of charisma and essentially a kind of yogic skill can be very dangerous. As we know, Hitler did it. I mean, even the swastika is a Buddhist symbol, an American Indian symbol. A sociology professor of mine in college We're a little off the subject here, but I'll tell you the anecdote.

[21:55]

He went to a Billy Graham revival meeting. So being a sociologist, he did what he wasn't supposed to do. So at some point, Billy said at the end of his talk, all of you who want to receive Christ now, come up to the theater. So he said, please bow your head. Bow your head. And the sociologist didn't. And he was watching. And Billy ducked down and a person dressed exactly like him stood up.

[23:01]

And he stood there like this while everyone filed past him to go into the room to receive Christ. So they walked past Billy and then they went into his room. There was Billy. I'm going to try that. She'll stand up like this and I'll sneak out and do Doug's sign. Yeah. I have a question about embodiment. When I came here for the first time and met you and also met the Sangha, I felt like this fits entirely into what I have felt myself for a long time.

[24:06]

and my question is, isn't it rather a kind of interaction between the Abhidharma and the physical refinement or making aware of what actually is, than that it is something completely new that we are creating. I experience it more as an interaction. And now my question is, is it not rather that there is an interaction between the Abhidharma and a kind of bodily subtle attunement, or bodily subtle... Of how... Yes. you attune your body to how we actually exist so that there is something that is also checking on our actual existence within our bodies.

[25:34]

And so, yeah, is that not rather an interaction between Abhidharma and what our bodies do? And, or, yeah, instead of something that... Our bodies already knows, but it is not so... conscious or not so differentiated because we don't have this mind. Yeah, I understand. Has it all been said in Deutsch? Yes. Okay. You guys are in charge, I'm just … Yeah, there's many ways in which we have some intuition of this, how we actually exist, whether we practice or not. And it's usually what leads us to practice. And there's various ways we could describe why that's the case. I would say often we have enlightened experiences which we don't recognize as enlightened experiences, but it makes our usual way we exist not make sense sometimes.

[26:59]

Or we're a person who always tends to trust our senses more than our culture. Oder wir sind jemand, der dazu neigt, dass wir unserem Sinn mehr Vertrauen schenken als unserer Kultur. So we keep having the experience that things don't quite compute. Also haben wir oft die Erfahrung, dass die Dinge nicht ganz zusammenpassen. Or there's also implicit teachings around all the time. You don't have to study Freud to have Freudian ideas. You don't have to study Buddhism anymore to have Buddhist ideas. But the Abhidharma we can understand as a tool to articulate and bring into our life this feeling.

[28:25]

And it was developed as a tool to understand the Buddha's teaching. Yes. Ich habe eine Frage, die mich quält. I have a question that tortures me. Tortures you? Bin ich ein Winterzweig? Am I a winter branch? Und ich kann mir sie nicht gut beantworten. Und ich werde die Einzige sein, die es beantworten muss. Ich kann mir keinen anderen beantworten. And I have not been able to answer that question for myself, but it seems that I'm the only one who can answer that question. But through today's lecture, I thought maybe it is a help, the answer that I've gotten from you.

[29:28]

It's a bit difficult, because it's very personal. I had... I'll put it this way. I don't think I'm anyone, because I can't push this wedge between the two realities. It is a little difficult because it's also very personal. But I think I'm not a winter branch because I cannot put this wedge between the two realities. Because my experience and my practice look like Because my experience and my practice I mean to me that I'm actually or I am quite confident or happy with what I am.

[30:44]

I want to explain that the Buddhist teaching, as soon as I received it and practiced it, is very enough for my life. I would say that the Buddhist teachings that I've heard are reaching very far into my life and are determining very many aspects of my life. through my profession, through my relationship, through all this, which is also important to me. But the penetration is just wonderful, it's like a gift. And this life, of course, consists of my job, my relationships. But there is a kind of penetration that is quite wonderful.

[31:51]

Infiltration. So that I think, when I think of the year cycle, winter, autumn, summer, spring... That I, if at all, get involved in such a late summer or autumn, because I also somehow have to see how I come to terms with the task in front of me. And now if I think in terms of the year cycle, winter, spring, autumn and summer, I feel more like late summer because I also have to deal with what's coming up next for me. Is late summer ahead of the winter or after winter? Is late summer before or after winter? And the only case in which I think this wedge is very necessary for me is if I were sick. That's something that I'm very scared of.

[32:53]

You've been through that, yeah. You've been through that. What that means. Can I say something to that? Because I think my question goes along with what Doris just said. Maybe it's not a question, but more a kind of insight or something. When I received this questionnaire, then I stumbled upon these two questions. How do you bring Zen into your life? I stumbled because of these two questions. First, how do you bring Zen into your life? But more so, how do you bring your life to Zen?

[34:17]

And then I noticed by listening to the rest of the lectures of Winter Branches 3, the last week of Winter Branches, that the question was a kind of trap. Which question? The question on the form? No. It was a trap for you? Yeah, for me. No. Wie bringst du dein Leben... The question, how do you bring your life into practice? It's the same aspect like in this morning's lecture. What are you deciding? What are you going to do with your life? Do you bring it entirely into practice or just a little bit? Okay.

[35:37]

Yeah, I mean, I want to create some problems for you. But I don't want to create problems that torture you. Well, maybe not torture you much anyway. Okay. I mean, on one level, you are part of the Winter Branches program. Why? Because you're sitting here. Because I accepted you. Because somehow you're here. So you can accept it at that level. And even if you shouldn't be here, just make use of it. Somehow you got in. And, of course, it's very different than I originally conceived of it.

[36:43]

I thought there'd be eight or ten people, that's all, and not, I don't know how many, 70 or something, 60 or something, I don't know. Forty. Forty altogether? Okay. Natürlich ist es inzwischen schon ganz anders, als ich mir das ursprünglich vorgestellt habe. Ich dachte, das sind so acht bis zehn Leute ungefähr, aber jetzt inzwischen sind es ungefähr 40. But also we need to ask the question personally for ourselves. Aber wir müssen uns diese Frage natürlich auch persönlich stellen. And I think really it can be most simply stated in this, what Volker brought up, Are you bringing practice into your life? Are you bringing your life into practice? And that's really a sense of the priority you give to the reality of practice. I think all of us do both.

[37:55]

But at some point we make a shift. And we really feel we're bringing our life into practice. And we understand things through practice. And if we study something else, we study it so that we can bring it into practice. Or we find we do that. Okay, someone else? Yeah. I would like to say something about something that strikes me in my experience and practice with the Abhidhamma.

[38:58]

that there is a phenomenon where the one with the other is fertilized. Where there is a connection and one needs the other. The host spirit also needs a certain kind of guests from time to time. I noticed that there's a kind of dynamic where one thing needs the other, where one thing is connected to the other. For example, where the host mind needs a guest. And there I observed that there are especially two types of guests who do that. And if I may explain it like that now, if I have the time.

[40:21]

One is the one guest or the one group of guests who enter the room of the host. He is very dominant and loud. And the host... In my sasen, I like to serve these guests to the host. He burns them. But it's also important to make them strong. This process. And there are particularly two kinds of guests who enter the space. There's the one kind which is quite dominant and bright. And in my zazen I like to feed the host mind with these guests. Sounds scary. I'm not sure I want to be your guest. But also the host mind needs that for nourishing and needs that in order to grow and become strong.

[41:27]

Mm-hmm. The other group of guests is a somewhat quieter group, which has such a flickering function, which also serves the host to somehow to make it possible. It's kind of like... like if you, for example, If you have a hard stomach and you are in the toilet and your stuff is not so loose, but then you take a book or a newspaper and have a little bit of the chatter of the words and then it works.

[42:35]

Yes. Or like with a mother, her child sings something to fall asleep and then the child resolves and can sleep well. So in this way. These guests have this function. The host also somehow... Are you going to translate this? And the other group of guests is a more silent group of guests which has a rather or she uses the image of the sound that water makes, that kind of function. And that group of guests is also necessary for the host mind.

[43:36]

It makes the host mind possible in a way. For example, if you are on the toilet and you have, what's the word, you can't get rid of your stuff, I'm constipated. Yeah, you're constipated. Then, for example, you read. You can't get rid of your stuff, okay. That's what she said, too, by the way. Yeah, and then you read a book or a few lines that soothe you and then it works. Or like, for example, a mother who sings a song to her baby in order to help the baby to go to sleep. Mm-hmm. Yeah. So what I mean to say is that this is a very fragile, subtle process, almost like a couple that dances a tango.

[44:41]

And I don't know why it is like that and what it should become, but it contributes to it. And somehow something new can or should develop through it. I don't know why it's this way and I don't know where it's headed, but something should develop from it. It's fun for someone that it's this way. So there is this wedge, but it does not have to be a case of two warriors or two fighting parties opposing each other.

[46:09]

That's true. It takes two to tango. Okay. When we are in the Zendo, much of the Zendo life is based on the Abhidharma. And when we do Kinyin, we're of course trying to continue the mind of Zazen. And then sit back down without too much interruption in this mind of sasana. But we're also teaching ourself to join our physical activity in our breath. Yeah, we're getting familiar with being very precise that we inhale with raising the heel.

[47:26]

And exhale with stepping forward. And at the same time maintaining about an arm's length distance from the person in front of you. Yeah, so you're just getting used to this walking, breathing coordination. And since it's not your usual way of walking, you have to pay a certain amount of attention to kin-hin.

[48:33]

If you're thinking about something else while you're doing kin-hin, your kin-hin won't be very exact. So, I mean, if your mind is really present in your heel as you inhale, and even sometimes the whole back of the leg and through the backbone is present, In the inhale, as you lift the heel. Not only is your zazen, your kin hin have a power, that is conveyed to the whole room and supports the whole room practicing. When you are really thinking about something else or what you're going to do later, the whole room doesn't feel Keen Hin as powerfully.

[49:50]

You actually deteriorate the Keen Hin of others. Wenn du an etwas anderes denkst, daran was du später noch machen wirst, dann fühlt der ganze Raum das Kin-Hin als nicht so kraftvoll. Du verschlechterst tatsächlich das Kin-Hin für den ganzen Raum. So you get to not only feel your own body in Kin-Hin. Also spürst du nicht nur deinen eigenen Körper im Kin-Hin. You can feel when your presence extends to others. Sondern du spürst auch, wenn deine Gegenwart sich auf andere ausdehnt. So this kind of experience is getting used to the Abhidharma. Und diese Art von Erfahrung bedeutet es, mit dem Abhidharma vertraut zu werden. So what the Abhidharma means by Abhidharmic mind is something you can discover in Kinyan. Okay, let's sit for a moment and then we'll have lunch.

[50:51]

Thank you for dressing me. You have no socks on. What happened? You got warmer. Thanks for watching!

[51:20]

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